They are illegal, and I think you can even be prosecuted if you're caught using one. 8-[

 

Kristen, this information is wrong!



Prong/pinch collars are legal (can be bought, sold and used) in the UK. They are rarely seen outside working dog circles and tend to stir up hysteria when pictures are shown to pet people...:?: Unfortunately, many people base their opinions on what a tool looks like and how it could be abused, rather than if it could be a useful training aid.:x
They are theoretically banned from use at affiliated Schutzhund clubs (by the (now defunct?) governing body), but this is completely ignored, in my experience.

 

Can pinch collars be used? It looks like a regular flat leather buckle collar, but it has pinch prongs on the inside.

 

Pinch collars are the same thing as prong collars, some call them pinch, some call them prong! Some people have been known to use a flat leather collar with nails inside, but that's not a pinch collar.

 

Thanks Ian, thats pretty much what I was thinking.

I suppose theres a big market over there for the Herm Sprenger "hidden" prong collars with them handy dandy nylon covers that go over them huh :lol:

 

Thanks Ian, thats pretty much what I was thinking.

I suppose theres a big market over there for the Herm Sprenger "hidden" prong collars with them handy dandy nylon covers that go over them huh :lol:

Yep, more and more people using them over the standard HS pinch.

I don't bother myself. I'm not embarrassed to use a pinch collar. I use as much positive reinforcement and negative punishment as I can in training, but there is nothing wrong (IMO) with a swift correction at times.

Funny how noone here in the UK has a problem with all the dogs walking around with head harnesses, haltis, canny collars, gentle leaders etc. but mention a pinch collar..[-X

 

Maybe I should arrange for an independant study linking gentle leaders to neck injuries Heck, its the internet, I can just slap MD on the end of my name and write an article, enough people would believe it :lol: :lol:

 

Hmmm, Mike Shoonbrood, MD that has a good ring to it Doc. Write an article please, particularly on the gentle leader, I'll refer to it. ha ha. Heck I may start using them on patrol dogs. I'll write a book on it's use in police circles and you endorse it.

DFrost

 

Sorry. I was told by someone who lives there that they are illegal.

 

There has been a lot of stuff written about prongs there Kristen and not much positive stuff. Tell the truth a lot of people in the UK still dont know if they are illegal or not.......its obviously confusing to everyone. When I first read this thread I was also of the same idea but thanks to Ian that misunderstanding has been cleared up. Good on ya mate!

 

The lady that told me they were illegal is familiar with and USES them (she used to have a Malinois that she did SchH with, but she's into Labs now), so she's not just an average pet owner going off of what she's heard or whatever. She said that they are not banned, but they are illegal, so you better not be caught using one. She said she disguises hers with a bandanna.

 

As a UK police officer I can tell you categorically that they are NOT illegal, banned or anything similar.

Period.

 

Interesting. I'll tell her she doesn't have to use a bandanna anymore! :lol:

 

Yeah...tell her she's no longer an outlaw =P~

 

Damn those hardened criminals and their prong collars! Ship em all to Australia I say!

 

Damn those hardened criminals and their prong collars! Ship em all to Australia I say!

On that note, prongs collars and ecollars are either banned or illegal in Australia.

 

In SOME states in Oz the Ecollar is banned. In some you have to get a letter from a vet to use one. The letters are easy to get, I'm told. Sorry I don't know where it's banned and where it's regulated. I can find out if anyone really needs to know.

 

She still seems pretty convinced that you can get in trouble if someone 'turns you in' for using one. This is what she said:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]From:klcabe[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]I just found out from a UK police officer that prong collars are not banned, nor are they illegal, so you don't have to use your bandanna anymore! LoL[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]From:mizcah[/FONT] [FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]
AHEMMMM WELL.. I'd just like to point out that, though you n me and a few of the population know they are not banned, the majority of Britts think they are banned, and it takes one person to complain that you are using one.. and trust me you will get fined and taken before a court.
you can purchase them and it's not illegal.. but it IS illegal to USE em.. go figure.
[/FONT]

 

She still seems pretty convinced that you can get in trouble if someone 'turns you in' for using one. This is what she said:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]From:klcabe[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]I just found out from a UK police officer that prong collars are not banned, nor are they illegal, so you don't have to use your bandanna anymore! LoL[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]From:mizcah[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]AHEMMMM WELL.. I'd just like to point out that, though you n me and a few of the population know they are not banned, the majority of Britts think they are banned, and it takes one person to complain that you are using one.. and trust me you will get fined and taken before a court.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]you can purchase them and it's not illegal.. but it IS illegal to USE em.. go figure.[/FONT]

Kristen,

I will say this again - they are not illegal, therefore no-one will get taken to court for using one (unless they are beating their dog around the head with it ).

The dog world is superb for perpetuating myths and rumours - I would ask this women if she can find any official documentation to show that they are illegal (of course she won't be able to because there is none...;-) ).

 

They are banned in the Uk only in context of the Police,Prisons and Military are not allowed to use them or electric collars. Since we introduced Pet passports and have easy access to european dogs we have great difficulty correcting the strongest, we can't even use the more primitive and less effective choke chain......only flat leather collars for PSDs.

Mark

 

Can I just emphasise...the use of prongs in the UK is definately legal and above board.

You will NOT be taken to court, as someone has suggested...as there's no offence in which to appear for...

Whilst police, prisons etc might not use them, the public can.

Having said that, their use is very few and far between...and I would say only a small number of sport and protection people actually use them..

 

Speaking of the land of Oz, a gal I know on a more pet oriented forum from Australia also mentioned how almost no one crate trains over there. Even her vet was shocked at the idea of her crate training her bullmastiff puppy.

 

Well said Ian !..

I know its not Kirsten's fault..but the other person she refers to is the reason why so many false rumours are rife in the dog world...

 

I've sent her everything you all have said, and she is somewhat reassured that she no longer has to fear going out in public with her dogs on the prong, but she is still going to research and try to find documentation, like you suggested, Ian.

This is her most recent reply:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]From:mizcah[/FONT] [FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]
ooOOooo this is all very interesting. I must admit, the only people I have worked with on this are police/military ppl, so maybe that's where I am getting it from.. but I am intrigued now. will hunt down what I can...[/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Sans Serif]I still hide the damn thing under bandana's. I wouldnt like to openly use one then get reported to RSPCA. People are ignorant sometimes. it's ok to yank your dogs head off with a check chain.. but use a pinch collar and ppl throw their hands up in horror. I think now it will just be "if YOU wanna take the pinch off this dog, feel free, I could use the giggle"[/FONT]

 

She said she signed up to join over here, btw. I guess she wants to talk to you guys 'in person!' :lol:

 

ahhhh found it.. this is what prompted me to join! no ppl over here really dont know where we stand regarding much.. the legal/judicial systme STINKS bigtime. as far as I have always been aware and instructed, pinch collars are readily available from the right source, it's perfectly legal to purchase one.. but you try using one see how far you get! honestly, ok on the sch field it would not be a problem, but out on everyday walks or to dog training (for pet ppl) classes.. yeah rite.. you cant even take a check chain to obedience classes in some clubs here. Two of my own hooligans would be out of control without a decent check chain on.. strolled in one night and got a barrage of abuse to take off the brutal chains.. wtf??!!! can just imagine the scene taking one in on a pinch. lovl.
anyways. I have been told that, yes you can very probably be prosecuted for using a pinch collar and it does depend on the rspca in that area. comes under something about mistreating animals by causing physical suffering.. dont wuote me on that but heyyy I WILL go find out fer sure. all these years and I have hidden Robbie's pinch under his bandana ;-) .

additionally, you cant even have a dog that is barking along your own perimeter fence round this neighbourhood! it is seen as a threat and I have been reported a few times and had the police pay me a visit.. can you believe that!

 

Gary and Ian.. I really do take exception to the tone you are taking against me lol. I am NOT the sort of person who would be behind such stoopid rumours, tho you did put it more eloquently than I. a question was asked and I answered it to the best of MY knowledge.. now I have trained with sch ppl for many years who think the same way that I do.. that you can be prosecuted by what would amount to, ignorant 'pet ppl' who know nothing about animals, but have to be 'seen to be doing the right thing'. Granted it is quite a few years since I have been 'on the field'. But I do still have a fair amount of dogs and do get opposition from time to time. it is frowned upon to chastise your own dog in some places here. I stand by everything I have said to Kristen, I know the councils around here wouldn't think twice about attempting to prosecute.

 

Mica,

Trust me there is no tone and I have not questioned your 'dog experience'...it's just that you're wrong on this.

The Animal Welfare Act covers any abuse and unecessary suffering to a dog - if you abuse a dog with a prong, a choke or a flat collar you can be prosecuted. This is not the same things as 'prong collars are illegal'.

The fact that many training classes do not allow prong collars, choke collars or e-collars is immaterial - the fact that they specifically do not allow them should tell you that they are actually legal....;-)

 

I do tend to get a wee bit fired up if I think I'm being called.. sorry. I was told it wasnt strictly legal to be seen using one.. and I never saw fit to question that.. now I KNOW different. still I am glad that I have been 'put right'. I just objected to being tarred with the same brush as ignorant pet ppl.
no more bandana's here.. dont like em anyways.
I graceously bow out of this one

 

I sit corrected (but not with a prong) hahahahaaaa

 

But telling people they are illegal is very effective. How many people in the UK do NOT use a prong collar because someone told them it was illegal? At some point, someone against their use either misunderstood the law, or simply felt they should be illegal and started telling others they were. And it snowballed from there, with people believing it and not taking the time to check the facts. And in the meantime "mission accomplished", many people no longer use the collars.

 

But telling people they are illegal is very effective. How many people in the UK do NOT use a prong collar because someone told them it was illegal? At some point, someone against their use either misunderstood the law, or simply felt they should be illegal and started telling others they were. And it snowballed from there, with people believing it and not taking the time to check the facts. And in the meantime "mission accomplished", many people no longer use the collars.

yeah and that was probably the whole set-up and what it was about. For someone it was mission acomplished.