Toughest/Best Dog Sport...

12509 Views 45 Replies 20 Participants Last post by Joby Becker, Aug 21, 2013

Clarence Pierre

Discussion Starter · Aug 10, 2013

Please give your opinion on the toughtest dog sport and why you feel it is so.

21 - 40 of 46 Posts

mike suttle

· #21 · Aug 11, 2013

I really think the toughest dog sport is sledding, not on a recreational level, but on a professional level.
The training involved in getting a dog ready for races like the Yukon Quest, or the Iditerod is brutal for the dogs and the handler. Many people discount dog sledding, but having done it for several years I can tell you that it is much, much harder on a dog than IPO, FR, MR, KNPV, or PSA.
I laugh when I read dog food companies say that they have "performance" food for millitary and police dogs. LOL How much different is the life of a Military and police dog really compaired to most active farm dogs? I grew up on a farm, never kept a dog on a chain or behind a fence, most of our dogs were herding breeds of some sort (border collies, cattle dogs, or a cross of the two) They were always running, killing shit, fighting with shit, chasing things, etc. Most active farm dogs need a better diet than most police or military dogs who spend most of their day in a crate, kennel, or on a couch somewhere.
Anyway, the long distance sled dogs are by far the most superior K-9 athletes that I can think of, and I don't know of any sports that test a dog's endurance, mental and physical toughness better than distance racing.

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Alex Scott

· #22 · Aug 11, 2013

mike suttle said:
I really think the toughest dog sport is sledding, not on a recreational level, but on a professional level.
The training involved in getting a dog ready for races like the Yukon Quest, or the Iditerod is brutal for the dogs and the handler. Many people discount dog sledding, but having done it for several years I can tell you that it is much, much harder on a dog than IPO, FR, MR, KNPV, or PSA.
I laugh when I read dog food companies say that they have "performance" food for millitary and police dogs. LOL How much different is the life of a Military and police dog really compaired to most active farm dogs? I grew up on a farm, never kept a dog on a chain or behind a fence, most of our dogs were herding breeds of some sort (border collies, cattle dogs, or a cross of the two) They were always running, killing shit, fighting with shit, chasing things, etc. Most active farm dogs need a better diet than most police or military dogs who spend most of their day in a crate, kennel, or on a couch somewhere.
Anyway, the long distance sled dogs are by far the most superior K-9 athletes that I can think of, and I don't know of any sports that test a dog's endurance, mental and physical toughness better than distance racing.

Way to think outside the box. I can imagine that this would be the most demanding dog sport. Do you have any videos of the training you are talking about?

Meg O'Donovan

· #23 · Aug 11, 2013

Here is a good Japanese-made video of the Yukon Quest. Iditarod gets more publicity but Yukon Quest is brutal, for dogs (icy rivers) and musher (sleep deprivation). I'm awed by the physical stamina and mental willpower required to even finish the race.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QA0QGoGf060

Eric Read

· #24 · Aug 11, 2013

Meg O'Donovan said:
Here is a good Japanese-made video of the Yukon Quest. Iditarod gets more publicity but Yukon Quest is brutal, for dogs (icy rivers) and musher (sleep deprivation). I'm awed by the physical stamina and mental willpower required to even finish the race.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QA0QGoGf060

I got a chance to meet Dallas Seavey last year after becoming the youngest winner of the iditarod. He's sponsored by a local company here and came back and did a presentation. Anyway, he told the story about the Yukon quest and it was the only race he was going to quit.

I forget all the details, but when he started out one day and it was cold, then it got a lot colder minus 30-40 degrees and he had to do a water crossing. He said the water would actually break thru the ice and flow over the top of the river and because it was so cold start to freeze again right away, but this particular one hadn't frozen over enough to support him and his team.

you can't really tell and he said him and his dogs broke thru in waist or chest deep water. Talked about how he got his team unhooked and safe and then finished that leg with one arm and the rest of him in a sleeping back that was kept dry in his bag. it took hours to chisel ice chunks that were boots off his feet.

but he didn't quit, went on to win I think and then win the Iditarod. He was a olympic caliber wrestler too, so he's a bit nuts.

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Tracy Davis-Sullivan

· #25 · Aug 12, 2013 (Edited)

Bob Scott said:
Great video but it's a perfect example of what were talking about. There are many "top level" AKC herders that could do the same job. .

I've never learned of someone that does AKC herding that can also manage Open level USBCHA herding. We're talking 500 yard outruns, unbroke sheep (and heck sometimes cattle) and terrain that can look impossible to overcome.

As with any dog sport it's all about a good dog being able to do it and a good trainer being able to get the best out of that good dog

Well, duh.

Because if we were talking about "most awesome dog on the planet" its probably some unknown dog working it's heart out not a dog participating in a sport.

Bob Scott

· #26 · Aug 12, 2013

"Well, duh. :wink: Because if we were talking about "most awesome dog on the planet" its probably some unknown dog working it's heart out not a dog participating in a sport".

I'll have to agree with that 100%!

Kadi Thingvall

· #27 · Aug 12, 2013

Tracy Davis-Sullivan said:
I've never learned of someone that does AKC herding that can also manage Open level USBCHA herding. We're talking 500 yard outruns, unbroke sheep (and heck sometimes cattle) and terrain that can look impossible to overcome.

Here's one example, my instructor Terry Parrish. Her BC's, which she breeds under the kennel name Blazin', have done both, many times.

Brenna, HC Blazin' Brenna HSAs HIAs HIBs HXAds HXBs, just won the purse at the 2013 Highland Games USBCHA Trial.

This is just one example, she's got quite a few dogs that have done well in USBCHA trials, locally and top 10 finishes in Nationals, who also compete in AKC. Brenna's brother Beau is also an AKC Herding Champion and has competed successfully in USBCHA trials.

It's not just the BC's either, a number of Terry's students that compete in AKC trials have also competed in USBCHA trials.

Joby Becker

· #28 · Aug 12, 2013

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Alex Scott

· #29 · Aug 13, 2013

Meg O'Donovan said:
Here is a good Japanese-made video of the Yukon Quest. Iditarod gets more publicity but Yukon Quest is brutal, for dogs (icy rivers) and musher (sleep deprivation). I'm awed by the physical stamina and mental willpower required to even finish the race.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QA0QGoGf060

Thanks for posting that, I had previously never seen anything on dog sled racing that wasn’t produced by Hollywood.

catherine hardigan

· #30 · Aug 14, 2013

mike suttle said:
I really think the toughest dog sport is sledding, not on a recreational level, but on a professional level.
The training involved in getting a dog ready for races like the Yukon Quest, or the Iditerod is brutal for the dogs and the handler. Many people discount dog sledding, but having done it for several years I can tell you that it is much, much harder on a dog than IPO, FR, MR, KNPV, or PSA.
I laugh when I read dog food companies say that they have "performance" food for millitary and police dogs. LOL How much different is the life of a Military and police dog really compaired to most active farm dogs? I grew up on a farm, never kept a dog on a chain or behind a fence, most of our dogs were herding breeds of some sort (border collies, cattle dogs, or a cross of the two) They were always running, killing shit, fighting with shit, chasing things, etc. Most active farm dogs need a better diet than most police or military dogs who spend most of their day in a crate, kennel, or on a couch somewhere.
Anyway, the long distance sled dogs are by far the most superior K-9 athletes that I can think of, and I don't know of any sports that test a dog's endurance, mental and physical toughness better than distance racing.

The Danish (or maybe it's Dutch... whichever country Greenland belongs to) still has a sled dog team maintained by the military. They go up and down the coast of Greenland every year. National Geographic had a super cool article about it several months ago. I think the oldest dog on the team was 10 or 12. A hard living for sure.

As an aside, I think the coolest - and quite possibly hardest - sport I've seen dogs compete in is Campagne. It seems to require a very complete dog. If I ever live in France, that's what I'll do.

Terrasita Cuffie

· #31 · Aug 14, 2013

Tracy Davis-Sullivan said:
I've never learned of someone that does AKC herding that can also manage Open level USBCHA herding. We're talking 500 yard outruns, unbroke sheep (and heck sometimes cattle) and terrain that can look impossible to overcome.

Well, duh. Because if we were talking about "most awesome dog on the planet" its probably some unknown dog working it's heart out not a dog participating in a sport.

Ya have to broaden your horizons. The first USBCHA trial I went to they had a 3 point hold on the sheep and all but three dogs ran straight up the middle. As for unbroke sheep or range ewes, at some point before the trial, they were worked by a dog if only to get them to the trial. Regardless, honest sheep actually are better to work than so called broke or soured sheep.

T

Gillian Schuler

· #32 · Aug 14, 2013

Joby Becker said:
high level agility competition looks pretty tough to me.

I guess it would do - you need to have good lungs:lol:

Gillian Schuler

· #33 · Aug 14, 2013

Clarence Pierre said:
Please give your opinion on the toughtest dog sport and why you feel it is so.

Tough for the dog for the handler? or both?

I guess FCI tracking is very tough for the dog. One forgets how exhausting "sniffing" out tracks can be for the dog.

Paul Cipparone

· #34 · Aug 14, 2013

When i do a seminar for a schH or tracking group, i ask them to breath ( take 200 breaths) without stopping . At the end they are exhausted , & that's just from breathing , no account for heat , dust , weed seeds i the nose, dust in the nose & mouth etc.
Paul C.

Bob Scott

· #35 · Aug 15, 2013

Gillian Schuler said:
I guess it would do - you need to have good lungs:lol:

And knees! ;-)

David Winners

· #36 · Aug 18, 2013

I hope Nosework progresses to the level of actual working dogs.

The toughest thing I have ever done with a dog is 6 kilometers of dismounted route clearance through the mountains, followed by searching every building (43 total) in a small village, followed by another 4 kilometers of route clearance. It was 105 degrees outside in the afternoon. This took us 9 hours to accomplish.

That could make for a cool sport!

David Winners

Paul Cipparone

· #37 · Aug 18, 2013

Yup that would be tough on both of you. Thank yo for your service.
Paul C.

David Winners

· #38 · Aug 18, 2013

Paul Cipparone said:
Yup that would be tough on both of you. Thank yo for your service.
Paul C.

The bitch had the hard job. All I did was carry her water LOL.

And you're welcome. I love my job.

David Winners

Meg O'Donovan

· #39 · Aug 19, 2013 (Edited)

David Winners said:
I hope Nosework progresses to the level of actual working dogs.

The toughest thing I have ever done with a dog is 6 kilometers of dismounted route clearance through the mountains, followed by searching every building (43 total) in a small village, followed by another 4 kilometers of route clearance. It was 105 degrees outside in the afternoon. This took us 9 hours to accomplish.

That could make for a cool sport!

David Winners

That would fall into the category of endurance or extreme sports.

In the 9 hours, how often did you rest her and for how long each time (if you can remember)? Water at each rest? What did she do during rest (her chosen behavior)? I know every dog is different but I'm curious to know about those pushing the envelope on endurance while retaining the ability to function.

What breed was the dog?
I'd like to give that dog a big can of stinky lamb tripe to show my admiration for the hard work. Your efforts as handler are also appreciated.

David Winners

· #40 · Aug 20, 2013

Meg O'Donovan said:
That would fall into the category of endurance or extreme sports.

In the 9 hours, how often did you rest her and for how long each time (if you can remember)? Water at each rest? What did she do during rest (her chosen behavior)? I know every dog is different but I'm curious to know about those pushing the envelope on endurance while retaining the ability to function.

What breed was the dog?
I'd like to give that dog a big can of stinky lamb tripe to show my admiration for the hard work. Your efforts as handler are also appreciated.

We rested twice on the infill, probably for 20 minutes each time. Once was for a tactical pause and once for a find. Neither time was because the dog had to stop. We had a half hour break while the leaders did their thing when we got to the village. We split the village into quadrants, so we had a short break 3 times while searching the village, plus another half hour before our exfil. We average 2 kliks per hour when searching.

I always offer water whenever we stop, but Fama isn't much of a drinker. I also gave her a liter of subcutaneous fluid right before we stepped off on the infill, so that probably helped. She usually drinks about half a liter an hour while working in the summer, and then a couple of liters between dinner and bed.

During rest periods, she is usually pretty alert until she starts getting tired. I make her lay down when we stop, and shade her with my body while she gets a drink and I take her temperature.

An important thing to note is that we spent 3 months preparing for this type of activity, including daily runs on the treadmill and on pavement. By the time we were active in Afghanistan, Fama was up to 8 miles every morning at 8 mph on the treadmill. Then on easy or off days, we would train for at least an hour on detection, and then finish with a 4 klik run up to an OP on a hill and back.

I've seen dogs die on missions half that long in cooler temperatures. You really have to prepare for this type of activity, especially in the heat.

Fama is a female GSD from Holland. She is between 70 and 80 pounds when she's in full deployment shape. She runs about 55 pounds when she's in the kennels for a while. She was 4-1/2 years old on our last deployment. She is one of those dogs that lives to work. When you drop the ramp, she's a handful. You should see her when we're on the LZ when a bird is coming in and she's in harness. Talk about drive leaking. She doesn't even sound like a dog LOL.

David Winners

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