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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well, here's how it went down for him, I guess: http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/06/02/D8I054DG2.html

I think the whole situation is bogus and a cluster but that's my speculation. :(

Anyway, just wondering for those who may know...what specific rules of engagement are given to MWD handlers about how the dogs can act around people? Is it just stuff that's inferred from things like the Geneva convention or are there specific things (You will not let a dog within 5 feet of an enemy combatant/prisoner) that a handler must learn and adhere to?
 

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I've tried three different answers to this post, each one infuriates me more than the other. To that end, I'll just have to agree with you that the
<<<the whole situation is bogus and a cluster >>>

Since I've not seen the rules of engagement for this particular fracas, I can't say. I can say this is not the first time occurance of this usage of an MWD.

DFrost
 

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Political Correctness sucks! It's all about CYA, public image, and who can we throw to the press on this one.
 

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You know, I don't see anything wrong with what he did. If the man was in prison and needed special guarding, I wouldn't have a problem with making the guy not DARE to make a move. But I'm a little biased because of a family member of mine was KIA in Iraq.
 

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Bob Scott said:
Political Correctness sucks! It's all about CYA, public image, and who can we throw to the press on this one.
that right there bob, is what pisses me off most about this. yeah, i can live with the fact that we as a society have grown soft and now take exception to letting our dogs bark at prisoners :roll: . BUT WHY THE HELL ADVERTISE THIS? this should be between the military and this soldier. nobody else needs to know about this kind of stuff. it makes us look weak. heaven forbid our imprisoned enemies be scared of us. oh no not that! i can understand the outrage if they were letting their dogs bite passive prisoners, but barking? c'mon....
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I guess what I'm wondering is--independent of Sgt. Caradona's case, which my guess is most of us feel is representative of a lot of things wrong with everything but Sgt. Caradona and his dog--what MWDs are told about protocol out of the gate. I recognize that this protocol was changed from very senior administration on down with this recent war, but just wondering.

Maybe Matt Hammond can comment on the protocol itself. And Matt, I'm sorry about your friend.
 

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SGT Santos Cordona

Let me clear a few things up.......

First off I served with Santos in Germany, Iraq, and Afghan. He is an outstanding soldier, father and friend. He was with me when I lost my partner and friend Donja in Kuwait. He was right there blood on his face helping me get her to the vet to try and save her, right there with me on the Helo pad when the vet looked at me and shook his head no telling me that she didn’t make it and right there with me as I cried like a school girl. He is a true friend one that most of us only come across once in a while.

He was put in a situation he could not win. The brass was covering their own butts on this one. These are people that would cut your head off if given a chance and all he did was let his dog bark at them. We did much worse in Afghan I promise you that.

Santos was on his THIRD deployment all back to back. He had been gone for over three years at the time of this incident. As a handler we where always asked by M.I. to help out with the "interviews" of the detainees. We would use the dogs as a tool to get people to talk. Fear is an awesome motivator and we would use this to our advantage. It worked we got and still get a lot of good Intel this way and if you think this is wrong or barbaric welcome to the real world and the ugly face of war. Now most of the stuff we did I really can’t get into but I can say this. As a MWD Handler your ROE (Rules of engagement) are set by the task force commander and or kennel master. We had a pretty open ROE. We could release if we felt threatened, to protect person or property, to displace crowds, and to protect the innocent in the area. Now this is loose version of it but it pretty much sums it up. Of course all bites and/or release would have to be reported to your KM, and on up the chain. When you are a SGT and an officer tells you to do something you do it and ask questions later that is life in the military you may not like it but you do it.

Santos was a very proactive handler a real go getter. He was an infantry man that reclassed into the Military Police Corp and then to K-9. He loved his job and did it well. I was with him in Afghan when things got real hairy and let me tell you when the bullets start flying I can’t think of a better person to have next to me. He was fearless in that aspect. Always put the Army and the mission first. Unlike some now a days. He got screwed nothing more nothing less, he was a scape goat a sacrificial lamb for the head shed. I get a lot of emails from tree hugging hippies that don’t think I should have his picture on the main page of my website, they don’t think I should support a “monster” like him; it could be bad for business. Well if you think this way then I don’t want your business anyway. Santos and Smith are the very reasons we can write and say the things we want, they stand up for and protect our very freedom to speak what is on our minds. So not to support them weather you agree or disagree to me is un-American.

The 90 days hard labor was just the military’s way of saying “hey we can’t prove anything and don’t have crap on you but since this made national media we need to do something”. I was and still am against the decision to embed the media with units during the war. The general public does not need to know what happens in war, they can’t handle it. They can’t and don’t realize that sometimes you have to do ugly things to people. I have seen this first hand and let me tell you not a night goes by that I don’t see the faces in my sleep. It sucks but that is what I signed up for. To protect our country and our way of life. The people that are complaining the most are the same people that are complaining about the immigration problem and how we should do something about it but don’t like the way we do it. The same people that will fly a American flag upside down at a high school in southern California and have the balls to question the Vietnam Vet that busts through the crowd to take it down and put it back up right. To these people I have this to say. If you don’t like it here you can always leave nothing is stopping you. At least John Walker had the balls to leave when he got fed up with the government. In this whole Rant about this I guess what I am trying to say is this Santos was convicted of something that happens all the time, it goes un said and un noticed UNTIL the liberal media gets a hold of it and blows it out of proportion. I am pissed at the way the Army shit on ones of its Heroes, a decorated veteran doing the things that most are afraid to do. I will say this about Santos as you can see in the picture you will never get him to hang his head or feel sorry for himself.

Santos if you read this keep your head up, you did nothing wrong . You walk proud knowing that you did what you where told, and I know you would do it again if you had to. No regrets!!

Weather you agree with me our not one thing is certain a great injustice was done and now Santos’s little girl will have to be with out her daddy for a while.

Matt Hammond
Quality K-9 Concepts
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Re: SGT Santos Cordona

Matt Hammond said:
As a MWD Handler your ROE (Rules of engagement) are set by the task force commander and or kennel master. We had a pretty open ROE. We could release if we felt threatened, to protect person or property, to displace crowds, and to protect the innocent in the area. Now this is lose version of it but it pretty much sums it up. Of course all bites and/or release would have to be reported to your KM, and on up the chain. When you are a SGT and an officer tells you to do something you do it and ask a question later that is life in the military you may not like it but you do it.
Thanks Matt, this is what I was wondering.

And thanks for your thoughtful post.
 

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As I seat here and typed this I remembered the speech I was given on the day me and a dude named Currier landed in Kandahar. We where told the the USMC ran the STHF (Short term holding facility) and how they would not let the red cross in because the detainess where trying to smuggle coded messages out about the lay out of the camp. I remember Santos getting wind of this and marching right over there with his dog Freida The ugliest little Mal/DSD you had ever seen. I saw him and said our hellos, welcomes, hows the wifes, and then i noticed his dog. I said "man that is the hell is that. He looks like a hihenna (how ever you spell it) I swear that was and is the ugliest, nastiest dog I have ever seen. You can see a picture of him on the main page of my site www.qualityk9concepts.com

Santos was so proud of the dog and took what I said hard. But no matter how you cut it that is one ugly a$$ dog.

Freida was his first dog out of school I think anyway he thought the dog was a real DonJuan. I have a few other pic I will post of him so you can see what I am talking about.

Anyway Santos will make it he is not the kind of guy that will let someone get the better of him. When all is said and done he is still a handler and he will aways have a spot reserved for him in my company.
 

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yes, thank you matt for telling the side of the story that the liberal tree hugging media don't care to report. that this guy was and is a hero. it's a shame that the guy who is doing what he is told gets the hammer dropped on him. at least in police work we usually have notice when the political winds change. case law comes down and then we must follow it. not so in the military. some brass want a fall guy and BAM. a guy gets punished for doing what he is told. what a damn shame...
 

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Thanks Matt for the explanation and for your great service to our country. I come from a military family and I can appreciate everything you said so well.
 

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Woody Taylor said:
Well, here's how it went down for him, I guess: http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/06/02/D8I054DG2.html

I think the whole situation is bogus and a cluster but that's my speculation. :(

Anyway, just wondering for those who may know...what specific rules of engagement are given to MWD handlers about how the dogs can act around people? Is it just stuff that's inferred from things like the Geneva convention or are there specific things (You will not let a dog within 5 feet of an enemy combatant/prisoner) that a handler must learn and adhere to?
I hate to say this. My entire life, since birth, has been the military. I believe in service, I believe in defense, I beleive in soldiers. The fact of the matter is that when teh public finds out about certain things that are considered SOP (standard operating procedure) and gets up in arms about it, our gov't immediately blames the soldiers. Under teh Uniform Code of Military Justice they don't have a leg to stand on when this sort of thing happens. It's all political, and we have no choice.

I have watched in disgust as numerous soldiers are convicted of "crimes" against the prisoners of Abu Grahib...it is nothing short of immoral the way soldiers are being offered up as sacrifices...
 

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Re: SGT Santos Cordona

Matt Hammond said:
Let me clear a few things up.......

First off I served with Santos in Germany, Iraq, and Afghan. He is an outstanding soldier, father and friend. He was with me when I lost my partner and friend Donja in Kuwait. He was right there blood on his face helping me get her to the vet to try and save her, right there with me on the Helo pad when the vet looked at me and shook his head no telling me that she didn’t make it and right there with me as I cried like a school girl. He is a true friend one that most of us only come across once in a while.

He was put in a situation he could not win. The brass was covering their own butts on this one. These are people that would cut your head off if given a chance and all he did was let his dog bark at them. We did much worse in Afghan I promise you that.

Santos was on his THIRD deployment all back to back. He had been gone for over three years at the time of this incident. As a handler we where always asked by M.I. to help out with the "interviews" of the detainees. We would use the dogs as a tool to get people to talk. Fear is an awesome motivator and we would use this to our advantage. It worked we got and still get a lot of good Intel this way and if you think this is wrong or barbaric welcome to the real world and the ugly face of war. Now most of the stuff we did I really can’t get into but I can say this. As a MWD Handler your ROE (Rules of engagement) are set by the task force commander and or kennel master. We had a pretty open ROE. We could release if we felt threatened, to protect person or property, to displace crowds, and to protect the innocent in the area. Now this is loose version of it but it pretty much sums it up. Of course all bites and/or release would have to be reported to your KM, and on up the chain. When you are a SGT and an officer tells you to do something you do it and ask questions later that is life in the military you may not like it but you do it.

Santos was a very proactive handler a real go getter. He was an infantry man that reclassed into the Military Police Corp and then to K-9. He loved his job and did it well. I was with him in Afghan when things got real hairy and let me tell you when the bullets start flying I can’t think of a better person to have next to me. He was fearless in that aspect. Always put the Army and the mission first. Unlike some now a days. He got screwed nothing more nothing less, he was a scape goat a sacrificial lamb for the head shed. I get a lot of emails from tree hugging hippies that don’t think I should have his picture on the main page of my website, they don’t think I should support a “monster” like him; it could be bad for business. Well if you think this way then I don’t want your business anyway. Santos and Smith are the very reasons we can write and say the things we want, they stand up for and protect our very freedom to speak what is on our minds. So not to support them weather you agree or disagree to me is un-American.

The 90 days hard labor was just the military’s way of saying “hey we can’t prove anything and don’t have crap on you but since this made national media we need to do something”. I was and still am against the decision to embed the media with units during the war. The general public does not need to know what happens in war, they can’t handle it. They can’t and don’t realize that sometimes you have to do ugly things to people. I have seen this first hand and let me tell you not a night goes by that I don’t see the faces in my sleep. It sucks but that is what I signed up for. To protect our country and our way of life. The people that are complaining the most are the same people that are complaining about the immigration problem and how we should do something about it but don’t like the way we do it. The same people that will fly a American flag upside down at a high school in southern California and have the balls to question the Vietnam Vet that busts through the crowd to take it down and put it back up right. To these people I have this to say. If you don’t like it here you can always leave nothing is stopping you. At least John Walker had the balls to leave when he got fed up with the government. In this whole Rant about this I guess what I am trying to say is this Santos was convicted of something that happens all the time, it goes un said and un noticed UNTIL the liberal media gets a hold of it and blows it out of proportion. I am pissed at the way the Army shit on ones of its Heroes, a decorated veteran doing the things that most are afraid to do. I will say this about Santos as you can see in the picture you will never get him to hang his head or feel sorry for himself.

Santos if you read this keep your head up, you did nothing wrong . You walk proud knowing that you did what you where told, and I know you would do it again if you had to. No regrets!!

Weather you agree with me our not one thing is certain a great injustice was done and now Santos’s little girl will have to be with out her daddy for a while.

Matt Hammond
Quality K-9 Concepts
I agree that he was rail roaded but this has nothing to do with your assertion of a so called liberal media and tree hugging hippies.
At least put the blame where it belongs instead of those ludicrous assertions.
It was this administration that scapegoated your friend. No one else.
 

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Re: SGT Santos Cordona

I agree that he was rail roaded but this has nothing to do with your assertion of a so called liberal media and tree hugging hippies.
At least put the blame where it belongs instead of those ludicrous assertions.
It was this administration that scapegoated your friend. No one else.
[/quote]


GIVE ME A BREAK Rick, whoever gave the ok to send these egobusted media people to a war needs his/her head examined. :twisted: :twisted:
I TOTALLY agree with Matt, a war is NOT a tea party, nobody wants it but you do like your freedom?? Well.. Hollywood stars and camera men are not going to defend it. I am SICK of the liberal blaming game.
Blame the ****** terrorist who started this crap.
I have been part of a softened/liberalized armed forces that now stands for very little.

Matt and Santos, you are what I call Great Americans.
You're right, IF YOU DONT LIKE IT.......LEAVE :!: :!: :!:

Very frustrated and pi**** off Dutchman
Robert
 

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Quote: IF YOU DONT LIKE IT.......LEAVE .... End



Let's keep the debate way above that level.

E. B. Hall:
I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.
-- The Friends of Voltaire, 1906
 

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Re: SGT Santos Cordona

Robert Blok said:
I agree that he was rail roaded but this has nothing to do with your assertion of a so called liberal media and tree hugging hippies.
At least put the blame where it belongs instead of those ludicrous assertions.
It was this administration that scapegoated your friend. No one else.

GIVE ME A BREAK Rick, whoever gave the ok to send these egobusted media people to a war needs his/her head examined. :twisted: :twisted:
I TOTALLY agree with Matt, a war is NOT a tea party, nobody wants it but you do like your freedom?? Well.. Hollywood stars and camera men are not going to defend it. I am SICK of the liberal blaming game.
Blame the ****** terrorist who started this crap.
I have been part of a softened/liberalized armed forces that now stands for very little.

Matt and Santos, you are what I call Great Americans.
You're right, IF YOU DONT LIKE IT.......LEAVE :!: :!: :!:

Very frustrated and pi**** off Dutchman
Robert[/quote]

HIP HIP HOORAY!!!!!

i love this dutchman...
 

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Re: SGT Santos Cordona

Matt Hammond said:
........I am pissed at the way the Army crap on ones of its Heroes, a decorated veteran doing the things that most are afraid to do. I will say this about Santos as you can see in the picture you will never get him to hang his head or feel sorry for himself.

Santos if you read this keep your head up, you did nothing wrong . You walk proud knowing that you did what you where told, and I know you would do it again if you had to. No regrets!!

Weather you agree with me our not one thing is certain a great injustice was done and now Santos’s little girl will have to be with out her daddy for a while.

Matt Hammond
Quality K-9 Concepts
Well said, Matt. Despite your feelings about the injustice and despite your anger about the "brass covering their own butts on this," that doesn't translate into you leaving because you don't like it.

It translates into you speaking up against something you believe went wrong with the running of our country. I'm thinking that's a true patriot: the person who fights for his country, defends his country, and has the guts to speak up when he feels that his country's Army has taken a wrong turn and "crapped on one of its heroes."

Good for you, that you exercise your right as an American to speak up.
 
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