[susan tuck]

My regular vet is now offering rattlesnake vaccinations. They are given in a series of two, & are only $20.0 a pop. So far, everything I have read points towards this being a good thing. Dogs are not immune from the venom, you still need to get them to a vet with anti-venom right away, but supposedly they are not as badly effected from the venom, & the recovery time is much faster. The only vaccination side-effects I have found is that there can be swelling, & it can be to the point where fluid needs to be drained off. There are just tons of rattlers around both where I live & where I hike. I saw one sunning on a dirt road yesterday. I was wondering if anyone has any information or experience with this they wouldn't mind sharing.
Thanks,
Sue

 

[Connie Sutherland]

My regular vet is now offering rattlesnake vaccinations. They are given in a series of two, & are only $20.0 a pop. So far, everything I have read points towards this being a good thing. Dogs are not immune from the venom, you still need to get them to a vet with anti-venom right away, but supposedly they are not as badly effected from the venom, & the recovery time is much faster. The only vaccination side-effects I have found is that there can be swelling, & it can be to the point where fluid needs to be drained off. There are just tons of rattlers around both where I live & where I hike. I saw one sunning on a dirt road yesterday. I was wondering if anyone has any information or experience with this they wouldn't mind sharing.
Thanks,
Sue

U.C.L.A. (or maybe U.C. Davis?) doesn't recommend them. Let me find that thing I read.

 

[Connie Sutherland]

QUOTE:

Canine Rattlesnake Vaccine

The canine rattlesnake vaccine comprises venom components from Crotalus atrox (western diamondback). Although a rattlesnake vaccine may be potentially useful for dogs that frequently encounter rattlesnakes, currently we are unable to recommend this vaccine because of insufficient information regarding the efficacy of the vaccine in dogs. Dogs develop neutralizing antibody titers to C. atrox venom, and may also develop antibody titers to components of other rattlesnake venoms, but research in this area is ongoing. Owners of vaccinated dogs must still seek veterinary care immediately in the event of a bite, because 1) the type of snake is often unknown; 2) antibody titers may be overwhelmed in the face of severe envenomation, and 3) an individual dog may lack sufficient protection depending on its response to the vaccine and the time elapsed since vaccination. According to the manufacturer, to date, rare vaccinated dogs have died following a bite when there were substantial delays (12-24 hours) in seeking treatment. Recommendations for booster vaccination are still under development, but it appears that adequate titers do not persist beyond one year after vaccination. Adverse reactions appear to be low and consistent with those resulting from vaccination with other products available on the market. The product licence is currently conditional as efficacy and potency have not been fully demonstrated. Based on existing evidence, the UC Davis VMTH does not currently recommend routine vaccination of dogs for rattlesnake envenomation, and the vaccine is not stocked by our pharmacy. END

It's UC Davis at
http://www.vmth.ucdavis.edu

Placerville Vet, a site I use a lot, agrees, but mentions which dogs SHOULD be vaccinated:
http://www.placervillevet.com/rattlesnake_vaccine.htm

And Marvista Vet, another site I use a lot, seems to think it's a good idea:
http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_rattlesnake_bites_in_californi.html

 

[Bob Scott]

Being a big herp freak when I was a kid, my concern would be that there are many different rattlesnakes. The anti-venom for a Diamond Back isn't the same for a Timber, etc.
I would think this vaccination would be similar. You would need one for each species/variety of snake.
Just guessin here!

 

[susan tuck]

Bob, the vaccination provides protection against all the rattlers native to California except the Mojave.

 

[susan tuck]

I still think your point is valid, though Bob. Even if my pup was vaccinated, I think it may just of buy some time to get him to a vet with anti venim, & it would still be important to know which kind of rattler it was. You know, I was walking the pup on a dirt road Friday evening & came across a rattlesnake lying in the road. I just turned around, & walked back, but I couldn't say what kind of rattler it was. I think if Arkane had come up on the snake he would have gotten bit. I'm seriously thinking of going to one of those seminars where they teach dogs to be afraid of snakes. Also, is it true that if a dog is bitten while out hiking, it is much better to carry the dog back to the car so that the venim doesn't circulate as fast as it would if the dog were walking or running?

 

[Connie Sutherland]

I still think your point is valid, though Bob. Even if my pup was vaccinated, I think it may just of buy some time to get him to a vet with anti venim, & it would still be important to know which kind of rattler it was. You know, I was walking the pup on a dirt road Friday evening & came across a rattlesnake lying in the road. I just turned around, & walked back, but I couldn't say what kind of rattler it was. I think if Arkane had come up on the snake he would have gotten bit. I'm seriously thinking of going to one of those seminars where they teach dogs to be afraid of snakes. Also, is it true that if a dog is bitten while out hiking, it is much better to carry the dog back to the car so that the venim doesn't circulate as fast as it would if the dog were walking or running?

Yes. Snake-bite instructions almost always mention not allowing the victim to exert unnecessarily.

 

[Bob Scott]

Yes! Definately carry the dog. Same if a person gets bit. Any physical activity just gets the venom moving faster through the system.
The vaccine probably doesn't cover the Mojave because their venom works on the nervous system as well as the blood.

 

[susan tuck]

Thanks, Connie & bob. So I just went to "rattlesnakes of so calif", which has pretty good pictures. I think if my dog got bit, I might not be able to tell one kind of rattler from another, besides being panicked, some of the differences seem very subtle, & I doubt the snake is going to wait around for me to verify what it is! I do stick to the trails or roads & don't let my dog wander around in the brush, but still, I like to hike in some pretty remote areas! Oh well, no sense dwelling on it is there, I mean I can't put the pup in a bubble!

 

[Bob Scott]

On a positive ote, 30% of most snake bites are what's called a dry bite. That means no venom is injected. It's not quite know if this is because the snake is trying to conserve it's venom on a defensive bite, or the snake's venom system is haywire because it's in a panic situation.

 

[Jeff Oehlsen]

Stun guns work well in emergency situations. The high voltage kills the proteins in the venom.

Yes, this dumbass has been bitten by a rattle snake. (lots, he was mine)

Really sucks when you have to try and do it to yourself. Kinda funny, really sad.

 

[Woody Taylor]

Stun guns work well in emergency situations. The high voltage kills the proteins in the venom.

Yes, this dumbass has been bitten by a rattle snake. (lots, he was mine)

Really sucks when you have to try and do it to yourself. Kinda funny, really sad.

Read this about an hour ago and thought to myself, "Self, that will be the weirdest thing you will read today." Kind of takes a load off my mind. :lol:

 

[Connie Sutherland]

Stun guns work well in emergency situations. The high voltage kills the proteins in the venom.

Yes, this dumbass has been bitten by a rattle snake. (lots, he was mine)

Really sucks when you have to try and do it to yourself. Kinda funny, really sad.

Wait.

It's early here.

You have been bitten lots? And you stun-gun YOURSELF? And the rattlesnake was your own snake?

 

[Kristen Cabe]

Stun guns work well in emergency situations. The high voltage kills the proteins in the venom.

Yes, this dumbass has been bitten by a rattle snake. (lots, he was mine)

Ohhhh this explains SO MUCH! :lol:

 

[Connie Sutherland]

On a positive ote, 30% of most snake bites are what's called a dry bite. That means no venom is injected. It's not quite know if this is because the snake is trying to conserve it's venom on a defensive bite, or the snake's venom system is haywire because it's in a panic situation.

Maybe they run out and haven't made more yet?

 

[Bob Scott]

On a positive ote, 30% of most snake bites are what's called a dry bite. That means no venom is injected. It's not quite know if this is because the snake is trying to conserve it's venom on a defensive bite, or the snake's venom system is haywire because it's in a panic situation.

Maybe they run out and haven't made more yet?

Nope! Somehow it's been tested. I might add that 30% of bites ALSO have heavy doses. 30% have normal. Whatever normal means.
Ok! For all you anal folks out there. It's 33 1/3%. I'll never be mistaken for a statitician. :lol: :wink: I doubt it's spread that evenly.

 

[Connie Sutherland]

.....Nope! Somehow it's been tested. I might add that 30% of bites ALSO have heavy doses. 30% have normal. Whatever normal means.
Ok! For all you anal folks out there. It's 33 1/3%. I'll never be mistaken for a statitician. :lol: :wink: I doubt it's spread that evenly.

It could be 30-30-30. Maybe 10% of the snakes refused to ansewer the questionnaire.

 

[Woody Taylor]

.....Nope! Somehow it's been tested. I might add that 30% of bites ALSO have heavy doses. 30% have normal. Whatever normal means.
Ok! For all you anal folks out there. It's 33 1/3%. I'll never be mistaken for a statitician. :lol: :wink: I doubt it's spread that evenly.

It could be 30-30-30. Maybe 10% of the snakes refused to ansewer the questionnaire.

Isn't that why young snakes (I thought) have potentially more deadly bites? They they are not experienced enough to conserve venom?

 

[Connie Sutherland]

.....Nope! Somehow it's been tested. I might add that 30% of bites ALSO have heavy doses. 30% have normal. Whatever normal means.
Ok! For all you anal folks out there. It's 33 1/3%. I'll never be mistaken for a statitician. :lol: :wink: I doubt it's spread that evenly.

It could be 30-30-30. Maybe 10% of the snakes refused to ansewer the questionnaire.

Isn't that why young snakes (I thought) have potentially more deadly bites? They they are not experienced enough to conserve venom?

In the interest of REALLY derailing this. I heard that young rattlers (which we have around here) are scarier because they don't have the warning rattles yet.

 

[Sarah Hall]

From what I've heard, baby rattlers don't yet know how to conserve their venom AND they come out of their egg with full venom sacs. From a tv show I used to watch a LONG time ago, about 70% of rattler bites are from babies because all they have is one button on their rattler, rather than the multiple ones adults have (every time they shed they form a new rattle). Wow, even MORE somewhat useless info I know. :lol: