if you are considering a prong, E collar, muzzle or any other added tool i would suggest you put them on the dog...yesterday
----didn't say USE them, just put 'em on
- conditioning with no/low conflict or pressure is a good thing
i would never wait to put on an Ecollar when i get to a proofing stage, regardless if you feel proofing is a stage or not.....that's just me; Khoi might feel different
i mentioned a muzzle because you said your end game is a PPD. i think you need to do muzzle work to properly train a PPD and if the dog is conditioned to think "game on" when the muzzle goes on, it might become a problem for other uses....of which there are many ;-)
Nice point about the muzzle. He hasn't worn one yet. I forget which type you like most for a Mal face. His face isnt super long, but not short either. He has a prong on for all walks, but he responds with a pretty light hand. He is also used wearing the e collar, as a back up, but not really for different types of proofing. Dont want to get you too of topic though. Thanks!
If you look at the video I just posted that I did for a client ... you will see that I am actually proofing while hes learning. At the .17 min mark you will see him lunge and catch himself and get back in position. I used a cue that was not correct but sounded similar he self corrected and it was marked.
starting with a freaking basic recall, which EVERY dog on the planet needs to have proofed or it will be a half ass recall and FAIL when it is most needed
- no matter whether it's a backyard pet, AKC show dog, truck dog, hunter, IPO/PSA competitor, PPD/PSD/MWD or SAR K9
Not trying to start a war but I will add to my "depends on the dog" another one.
"Depends on the trainer"
My reciently passed 12 1/2 yr old GSD Thunder was SAR trained in cadaver, live find, boat work, article search. AKC CDX, HT, Sch III. TT and his CGC cert.
Till the day he died he never had a leash, pinch, choke, E-collar correction in his life.
As a pup he got scruffed a few times for house manners and that's it.
This was the point of my commenting on Matts friend that did IPO with Operant conditioning and my comment about how much bs we ran into when it was discussed with many other trainers.