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Testing or Training The Lines Blurred
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Old 04-04-2017, 01:05 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Testing or Training The Lines Blurred

I was visiting with a friend who is also a dog junkie. We were talking about the reasons why we see all these dogs who have been subjected to to much pressure to soon. He concluded that a lot of what we are seeing is the result of people not understanding the difference between testing a dog and teaching/training a dog. They take a young dog and begin to apply the pressure one might want to see later in the progression or maybe to much for the pups temperament to early. Or a lot of other reasons. IMO its a matter of understanding what we are looking at and reading the dog. What is your idea on why it is we see these dogs so much? what is your advice for reading the dog to prevent this for someone who is new and getting started?
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Old 04-04-2017, 01:40 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Testing or Training The Lines Blurred

not sure what type of training you're referring to....maybe early bitework ?

but regarding "reading a dog" here's what i tell EVERYONE i train with

spend more time WATCHING YOUR DOG and less time talking to it, pulling on the lead and trying to get it to DO something

since we often work out in public places this becomes easy once they understand. i show them how they can apply markers when they are doing NOTHING but watching their dog react with the environment around it
- simple crap like waiting for the damn dog to settle and go into a down by itself and MARKING it. checking out some 'incoming' weirdo and then turning away rather than reacting to it and MARKING it. waiting for the dog to stop "scanning for incoming" and simply LOOK at the handler, and MARKING it... the list is endless

- to me that's a direct way i can teach "reading a dog", and it's almost funny when the light bulb goes off and the owner realizes they can train their dog while they sit on their ass //LOL//
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Old 04-04-2017, 01:49 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Testing or Training The Lines Blurred

Quote:
Originally Posted by rick smith View Post
not sure what type of training you're referring to....maybe early bitework ?

but regarding "reading a dog" here's what i tell EVERYONE i train with

spend more time WATCHING YOUR DOG and less time talking to it, pulling on the lead and trying to get it to DO something

since we often work out in public places this becomes easy once they understand. i show them how they can apply markers when they are doing NOTHING but watching their dog react with the environment around it
- simple crap like waiting for the damn dog to settle and go into a down by itself and MARKING it. checking out some 'incoming' weirdo and then turning away rather than reacting to it and MARKING it. waiting for the dog to stop "scanning for incoming" and simply LOOK at the handler, and MARKING it... the list is endless

- to me that's a direct way i can teach "reading a dog", and it's almost funny when the light bulb goes off and the owner realizes they can train their dog while they sit on their ass //LOL//

my description was kinda lacking for sure... yes the early bite work ... the point where it all goes wrong and we see these dogs start displaying all kinds of strange behaviors.
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Old 04-04-2017, 02:05 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Testing or Training The Lines Blurred

prob a lotta ways to do that to a dog
some that come to mind
- not really evaluating the dog's potential before they start "working it". iow, does the dog really LIKE bitework ?
- is prey drive a valid indicator ? sometimes i think NOT
- and if prey drive doesn't get a result a LOT of folks will try to tap too quickly and deeply into the defensive side
- lots of backyard helpers will take someones dog and start agitating it after giving it a flyby 10 min eval which in my opinion is NEVER enough time to evaluate a dog for any level of serious bitework expected later
- many think swingin a young pup around while it clamps down on a rag shows grip potential. i've only seen that A FEW HUNDRED TIMES
- my advice that i listed is the same for trainers who will be doing bitework
- some people just don't understand how to build confidence and a desire to grip.....they just mimic stuff they see on youtube
- if you can't CLEARLY see exactly how a helper is actually HELPING build up the pup....they SUCK as a helper

is this the kinda stuff you were asking about
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Old 04-04-2017, 02:12 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Testing or Training The Lines Blurred

what kind of "strange" behaviors ?
- redirecting on the handler ?
- typewriter chewing ?
- vocalizing ?

not sure i know what you mean...can you list a few ?

i'm lucky cause all the mwd's i see are trained, or at least were trained but maybe having a slight prob here or there that the handler needs to deal with
- i don't wok with green dogs so maybe i'd better back out of this
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Old 04-04-2017, 02:21 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Testing or Training The Lines Blurred

Quote:
Originally Posted by rick smith View Post
what kind of "strange" behaviors ?
- redirecting on the handler ?
- typewriter chewing ?
- vocalizing ?

not sure i know what you mean...can you list a few ?

i'm lucky cause all the mwd's i see are trained, or at least were trained but maybe having a slight prob here or there that the handler needs to deal with
- i don't wok with green dogs so maybe i'd better back out of this

we are wading deep in the green dog realm with this one brother rick lol
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Old 04-04-2017, 02:23 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Testing or Training The Lines Blurred

Quote:
Originally Posted by rick smith View Post
they can train their dog while they sit on their ass //LOL//
STOP exposing these things lol
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