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Place behavior
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Old 04-02-2017, 07:47 PM   #1 (permalink)
Ankle Biter
 
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Place behavior

I went to a Forrest Micke Seminar about a month ago. He suggested teaching a place behavior to increase intensity in our training. We have been working on teaching it but I am just not seeing the intensity I am hoping for. We are still using food to teach. I am not totally sure how to change to toy or even if it will be worth the effort. I have no interest in using place for in the house - I am only hoping to get more intensity in his work. If anyone uses the place behavior or has opinions or suggestions I would be glad to hear them.
Here is a video of our session.
https://youtu.be/VVrMVXYJkgE
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Old 04-02-2017, 08:37 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patty Beck View Post
I went to a Forrest Micke Seminar about a month ago. He suggested teaching a place behavior to increase intensity in our training. We have been working on teaching it but I am just not seeing the intensity I am hoping for. We are still using food to teach. I am not totally sure how to change to toy or even if it will be worth the effort. I have no interest in using place for in the house - I am only hoping to get more intensity in his work. If anyone uses the place behavior or has opinions or suggestions I would be glad to hear them.
Here is a video of our session.
https://youtu.be/VVrMVXYJkgE

I use it and it is fundamental foundation work for me in the training here. Do you ever use target boxes? I see you have a raised platform and that is great. Its a great way to teach position too... you are working to hard at it I think Patty.
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Old 04-03-2017, 03:16 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

no way to compare to what you saw in the seminar since i didn't, but what i saw in the clip was a lot of static OB (the wait, etc) "non"-movement which might be affecting the drive aspect.

kinda looks like he's watching you intently to wait and not make a mistake

i also don't think that environment (smooth floor, carpet on top, etc) gives him a chance to dig in and take off the way you're wanting him to move

i would look for an better place to do drive building
i use places outside that have a 3-4 ft rise that i can jog along and make the dog do a lot of up and downs and keep them moving, and then throw in some downs once the dog gets into it. this might sound like i'm not using "place" mats, but actually i do...not the larger box types though

depending on the dog, some need more distance to get some speed built up rather than a place mat or box placed closer together. i do use em but i like to build drive more with recall-related drills

sorry if this doesn't help....more like observations than suggestions
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Old 04-03-2017, 03:19 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

don't take this as being sarcastic,
-- but IME, dogs who give the impression they are thinking are often not as high drive as those who appear brain dead //lol//
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Old 04-03-2017, 03:21 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

the perfect dog would be a blend of both, but i i'm rarely lucky enuff to meet those kind //rotflmao//
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Old 04-03-2017, 07:02 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

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Originally Posted by Brian Anderson View Post
I use it and it is fundamental foundation work for me in the training here. Do you ever use target boxes? I see you have a raised platform and that is great. Its a great way to teach position too... you are working to hard at it I think Patty.
Not totally clear on what a "target box" is.
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Old 04-03-2017, 07:06 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

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Originally Posted by rick smith View Post
no way to compare to what you saw in the seminar since i didn't, but what i saw in the clip was a lot of static OB (the wait, etc) "non"-movement which might be affecting the drive aspect.

kinda looks like he's watching you intently to wait and not make a mistake

-yes - definitely - that was what I thought I was supposed to be getting. What I was looking for was him to be excited to the core for the release word then explode off and run back to place. This is how it was explained to me (at least that is what I heard)
i also don't think that environment (smooth floor, carpet on top, etc) gives him a chance to dig in and take off the way you're wanting him to move

i would look for an better place to do drive building
i use places outside that have a 3-4 ft rise that i can jog along and make the dog do a lot of up and downs and keep them moving, and then throw in some downs once the dog gets into it. this might sound like i'm not using "place" mats, but actually i do...not the larger box types though

Would love a little more detail on this. So, you stop them on the "place" as your moving by it? [/COLOR][/COLOR]
depending on the dog, some need more distance to get some speed built up rather than a place mat or box placed closer together. i do use em but i like to build drive more with recall-related drills

sorry if this doesn't help....more like observations than suggestions

Last edited by Patty Beck; 04-03-2017 at 07:09 AM.. Reason: try to highlight my reply
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Old 04-03-2017, 07:11 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

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Originally Posted by rick smith View Post
don't take this as being sarcastic,
-- but IME, dogs who give the impression they are thinking are often not as high drive as those who appear brain dead //lol//
He is definitely a thinking dog.....
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Old 04-03-2017, 07:51 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

i'll take a diff approach and relate it to the way you are working the drive building inside

1. don't always walk him to the place box unless he does not know the command and will not go by himself. if that's the case, work on it til he knows to go there on a verbal cue (mini-send out; which is what this is normally used for). walking with you is a no brainer for him
2. once he's there, don't freeze him up and make him wait...that's a drive killer not builder as i saw it. to me, he tends to start to relax and settle the longer he's on the box rather than load up and get ready to explode, etc.
- iow do short reps and don't require much of a stay (which is static rather than drive building for him right now)
3. if you are at the box don't dish out a lot of treats. that is usually done to teach a dog to hold a position, which is not a problem for him that i observed. rather, quickly back off then CALL him ! since he's food driven, only jackpot the fast responses. if it's slow just give him a pat on the rump ?
- duration can only build drive when you are capping drive that's already there (i didn't see drive capping)
4 overall, i think upping your intensity might affect his also, and if he breaks early, so what ? no biggy...just motion or lure him a bit to get him back on his box

these are tailored to what i saw...but i've only seen him a minute ... you obviously know him a LOT better //lol//
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Old 04-03-2017, 08:01 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Place behavior

Quote:
Originally Posted by rick smith View Post
i'll take a diff approach and relate it to the way you are working the drive building inside

1. don't always walk him to the place box unless he does not know the command and will not go by himself. if that's the case, work on it til he knows to go there on a verbal cue (mini-send out; which is what this is normally used for). walking with you is a no brainer for him
2. once he's there, don't freeze him up and make him wait...that's a drive killer not builder as i saw it. to me, he tends to start to relax and settle the longer he's on the box rather than load up and get ready to explode, etc.
- iow do short reps and don't require much of a stay (which is static rather than drive building for him right now)
3. if you are at the box don't dish out a lot of treats. that is usually done to teach a dog to hold a position, which is not a problem for him that i observed. rather, quickly back off then CALL him ! since he's food driven, only jackpot the fast responses. if it's slow just give him a pat on the rump ?
- duration can only build drive when you are capping drive that's already there (i didn't see drive capping)
4 overall, i think upping your intensity might affect his also, and if he breaks early, so what ? no biggy...just motion or lure him a bit to get him back on his box

these are tailored to what i saw...but i've only seen him a minute ... you obviously know him a LOT better //lol//
This sounds allot like how we have been working our send outs. I use a approx. 12" X 12" carpet piece send him out as soon as he hits the target its release back to me for the toy.
So, if I am understanding you correctly, I could be working this the same way? Kind of eliminate the whole need to stay on the box - just hit it?
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