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Herding + PP training
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Old 06-14-2016, 10:11 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

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Originally Posted by Bob Scott View Post
Just as most all "trained' behaviors having a genetic link to the wild canines.

Having done scentwork, herding and retrieving are ones that stand out for me as something many dogs have naturally and we just redirected it to serve us.
I put alot of weight on this when choosing puppies, it's a massive indicator of whether the puppy is gonna want to work with you IMO. Having said that, Sali was awesome at getting stuff and bringing it back, letting me have it was another story, lol
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Old 06-14-2016, 02:41 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

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Having done scentwork, herding and retrieving are ones that stand out for me as something many dogs have naturally and we just redirected it to serve us.
I don't see retrieving as a natural behavior. I see them chasing after some thing you throw and then running after it to grab it up (and maybe keeping it) as a natural behavior before I see them running to bring back to you something you threw. I think "retrieving" as in bringing back to you the duck you just shot more of a learned form of the natural tendency to go and grab something that was getting away. The dog will chase the ball but you have to teach them that *if* they bring it back, you will throw it again. That's learned behavior in my book.
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Old 06-14-2016, 09:51 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

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I put alot of weight on this when choosing puppies, it's a massive indicator of whether the puppy is gonna want to work with you IMO. Having said that, Sali was awesome at getting stuff and bringing it back, letting me have it was another story, lol
Ain't that the truth! I've never had to teach any of my GSDs to retrieve, they seem to come out of the womb doing that, but the giving it up part....the struggle is real!!!!!

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Old 06-14-2016, 11:19 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

I think that retrieving goes beyond grabbing something that is getting away.

That to me is prey drive.

To ME the willingness to bring something back is the genetics to return that something to the den in order to feed the cubs.

I've found all the dogs I've had that tested for a good to natural retrieve were the ones that were more willing to work with the pack, the leader, the trainer whatever you want to call it.

In the past I taught all my terriers to retrieve even though none had any desire to bring it back on their own.

My 12 yr old GSD was a natural retriever from the first time I tested his litter at about 4 wks old.

My 9yr old GSD would chase anything but it had no desire to bring it back without marker training.
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Old 06-15-2016, 06:41 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

Don't know. I've had all my dogs go after a ball and grab it. Then they just run around with it in their mouth. Can't say they would "retrieve" or carry it back to me. Most of the time, it's a "I caught it, I'm keeping it" kinda thing. What most would term toy possession and not retrieving.
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Old 06-15-2016, 09:08 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

Hmm, my dog was born retrieving, including the bringing it back and dropping it.
Never had to teach him it would only get thrown again if he brought it back, never had to teach him to drop it.
He started from the first time I played fetch with him.

Tugging on the other hand is something I have to work to get him to appreciate. He loves to chase the toy to catch it, but tugging just seems to dampen his enthusiasm for the toy.
Same with my sisters cocker.
In fact she has not been trained to play ball when young, and has possession issues with her toys, yet will still always return back to the person who threw it even though she does not want to give the ball to them, and will refuse and fight having to do so.

I would guess that retrieving is instinct, but I don't know much tbh.
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Old 06-15-2016, 09:13 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Scott View Post
I think that retrieving goes beyond grabbing something that is getting away.

That to me is prey drive.

To ME the willingness to bring something back is the genetics to return that something to the den in order to feed the cubs.

I've found all the dogs I've had that tested for a good to natural retrieve were the ones that were more willing to work with the pack, the leader, the trainer whatever you want to call it.

In the past I taught all my terriers to retrieve even though none had any desire to bring it back on their own.

My 12 yr old GSD was a natural retriever from the first time I tested his litter at about 4 wks old.

My 9yr old GSD would chase anything but it had no desire to bring it back without marker training.
Interesting...I'm so glad there has always been at least one thing I haven't had to teach... all of my GSDs from the time they are little pups, go out grab and bring back whatever I toss....they just don't want to out it until taught, and I like that, I like a dog who naturally has a firm, full, hard grip, pays off in spades when it's time for dumbbells because it facilitates fast go outs and backs, no mouthing, no rolling, no chewing.
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Old 06-15-2016, 09:36 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

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Don't know. I've had all my dogs go after a ball and grab it. Then they just run around with it in their mouth. Can't say they would "retrieve" or carry it back to me. Most of the time, it's a "I caught it, I'm keeping it" kinda thing. What most would term toy possession and not retrieving.
Here you go, Ino at 9 weeks old

dumbbell retrieve
https://youtu.be/aGaBjsHRwoY

tug play
https://youtu.be/DDvi253rL34

litter mate to my pup @ 9 weeks old:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NnjuuSqSvQ
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Old 06-15-2016, 11:33 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

I've owned 5 different terrier breeds and numerous terrier crosses.

Can't say that any one of the evil little bassids though bringing back anything I tossed was a benefit to them.

Did they all mind? You bet, but teaching the retrieve "old school" was a war with a couple of them.

My JRT in particular was like working with a runaway chainsaw that seemed to have a chain at both ends.

Probably wind up with another of the evil little bassids when Trooper's gone.

After all......I'll only be in my mid 70s by then.
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Old 06-16-2016, 08:28 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Re: Herding + PP training

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Originally Posted by bob scott View Post
i've owned 5 different terrier breeds and numerous terrier crosses.

Can't say that any one of the evil little bassids though bringing back anything i tossed was a benefit to them.

Did they all mind? You bet, but teaching the retrieve "old school" was a war with a couple of them.

my jrt in particular was like working with a runaway chainsaw that seemed to have a chain at both ends.

probably wind up with another of the evil little bassids when trooper's gone.

After all......i'll only be in my mid 70s by then.
bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah!
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