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Too much affection
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Old 08-10-2015, 04:16 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

No it wasn't that, I Dont work my dogs a day before so there well rested. They just think a dog should only be out to work and go to potty. This isnt everyone felling just some in the club.
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Old 08-10-2015, 11:32 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

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No it wasn't that, I Dont work my dogs a day before so there well rested. They just think a dog should only be out to work and go to potty. This isnt everyone felling just some in the club.

This goes back to the hunting dog folks that say keeping the dog confined will build it's drive to hunt.

I suppose many still follow this method but I see more hunting dogs that are also family pets and it doesn't seem to hold them back in the field one bit.

I did earthwork with terriers for a number of years and all my working terriers were house dogs. One of my Border terriers was even a big winning show dog in both AKC and Working Terrier Shows in addition to being hell on wheels in the ground.

I had the #1 Nationally ranked Kerry Blue in AKC obedience competition in the early 80s. He was a great above ground ratter, groundhog, possum, raccoon catcher and would also find, point (sort of ) and flush quail.

Pampered maybe a bit but never spoiled.
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Old 08-11-2015, 09:39 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

I don't subscribe to the theory as a whole.

BUT..

I have owned several dogs that I THINK (Appeared to me) benefited from being crated for a period of time before training.

These are my theories as to why it appeared to beneficial for certain dogs.

Some to slow them down for a period, to conserve energy.
Some to clear their mind, calm them, they obviously were meditating in the crate.
Some I think it frustrated them..

Some I think may also "Lose Their Minds" as Brian so eloquently put it, which in some cases, is just what the doctor ordered, depending on what you are doing...

All I can say is that I think it can be an effective influencer on some dogs..crating whatever...

I used to do detection and tracking drills at home and around the neighborhood with my last few dogs... and it was really interesting to see and to hear the dog inhaling the scent in the crate, and exploding out of the crate (when let out) to get to work...

I think that their just may be something to the idea of rest/crate/isolation for some periods of time, benefitting some dogs in certain situations...

I also think it wont necessarily "build drive" as some people say, but it just might get the dog in the right state of mind for whatever reason...

as with people who go to work, some dogs just might work better after sleeping or a nap....some dogs can relax more while being isolated or crated...not much else to do....
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Old 08-11-2015, 12:27 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

And theres the difference. Crating a dog before work v. isolation.

What I got from the original post/question was isolation, which I see plenty of, where the dog lives in a crate. No interaction with anyone until its time to train or work. Which, as I said, doesnt seem to build any more drive. When I said some loose their minds after coming out of the crate, what I meant was they are so excited to be out, they cant seem to focus on anything, until persistant correction "calms" them down. They are too interested in the world around them. I also have only seen this with dedicated sport dogs who only ever see the training/trial field.

I think most of the dogs I work with (including mine) stay crated (or confined to the back of the car) until its time to work, but thats only when they are out to work. They also know when they come out of the crate with their harness on, theres no screwing around...its time to work. After that, mine are house dogs and my buddies...out and about interacting with me as much as they, or I, want. Again, no loss in drive or focus.
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Old 08-11-2015, 11:18 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

I agree with Brian's "crated vs isolation".

ALL of my dogs are crate trained but none have ever been crated/kenneled/confined to the point of isolation.

Brain, as to "They know when they come out of their crate with their harness on, there's no screwing around".

A big ditto!

When my brother had his Kerry Blue I showed it in the breed ring and he showed it in the obedience ring.

The difference between his attitude changed 360 when his collar went for the show martingale to the training collar or vs vsa.

He was full of fire in both rings but became a trained soldier in the ob ring.

Undefeated to his CH in the breed ring and undefeated to his CDX in the OB ring with a High In Trial his first time ever in the ob ring.
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Old 08-12-2015, 06:12 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

We crate our dogs at the club before and between exercises.

One, the dog can't connect a poorly done exercise maybe with correction, to the next exercise.

Two, yes, they come out ready to deliiver.

The idea of crating a a hund for hours on end to "whet its appetite" is years and years outdated.
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Old 08-12-2015, 09:10 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

I've found that keeping my dogs together actually builds drive. Each wants to be the first one out and gets more antsy when they are the one left behind.
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Old 08-12-2015, 09:14 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

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Originally Posted by Brian McQuain View Post
And theres the difference. Crating a dog before work v. isolation.

What I got from the original post/question was isolation, which I see plenty of, where the dog lives in a crate. No interaction with anyone until its time to train or work. Which, as I said, doesnt seem to build any more drive. When I said some loose their minds after coming out of the crate, what I meant was they are so excited to be out, they cant seem to focus on anything, until persistant correction "calms" them down. They are too interested in the world around them. I also have only seen this with dedicated sport dogs who only ever see the training/trial field.

I think most of the dogs I work with (including mine) stay crated (or confined to the back of the car) until its time to work, but thats only when they are out to work. They also know when they come out of the crate with their harness on, theres no screwing around...its time to work. After that, mine are house dogs and my buddies...out and about interacting with me as much as they, or I, want. Again, no loss in drive or focus.
I agree, and by and large, this is what works for me, but by the same token I've seen great dogs who have great bonds with their handlers who are kenneled dogs and primary interaction is on the training field. Different strokes, right?
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Old 08-12-2015, 09:17 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

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Originally Posted by Bob Scott View Post

ALL of my dogs are crate trained but none have ever been crated/kenneled/confined to the point of isolation.
I'm probably doing this all wrong but I'm not crating the new pup unless I have to. He wails like a banshee in the crate non-stop. He gets all frantic and stirred up but turn him loose and he will lay down by you all nice and quiet. He just wants to be with you. So around the house and such, he gets free rein. When I leave he's still not crated but gets a reduced house space but full run of the backyard. As he gets older then I will start crate training but won't at this stage of the game. Right now it's lots of loving, learning how to get along with the other dogs, and just being a nosy pup.
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Old 08-12-2015, 10:49 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Re: Too much affection

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Originally Posted by Sarah Platts View Post
I'm probably doing this all wrong but I'm not crating the new pup unless I have to. He wails like a banshee in the crate non-stop. He gets all frantic and stirred up but turn him loose and he will lay down by you all nice and quiet. He just wants to be with you. So around the house and such, he gets free rein. When I leave he's still not crated but gets a reduced house space but full run of the backyard. As he gets older then I will start crate training but won't at this stage of the game. Right now it's lots of loving, learning how to get along with the other dogs, and just being a nosy pup.

Mine are all crate trained for the purpose of trials, shows, etc but they are rarely in them other then those few reasons.

Puppies only at night and I'll still get up at least once a night until they are 7-8 months old. From there they either get free run of the house at night or then become outside dogs.
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